Curse

Two April Mornings · Oct 11, 2006, 08:14 PM // 20:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

In addition - this has a very bad side effect - all OTHER GPB's (i.e. without a req 7 or req 8) will now become worthless. If that 14>50 GPB you have had a requirement of 10 or higher, it becomes merchant material...when you probably could have sold it for 3-4K on the open market or in our auction site.

Definitely. This inscription addition, in the way that we are imagining it, would definitely exasterbate the problem with low req vanity skins. It actually isn't even a problem right now, it's just a side of the game that certain people are drawn toward. By adding inscriptions, I feel that almost everyone will have to be drawn to that side of the game (the trading and economic side). Making 75k for a set of 15k armor isn't all that hard--right now you can either merchant or farm for a bit, or even just quest in Cantha. By introducing inscriptions, I fear that there will be a serious drop in weapon price, because, as I and others have side, only one specific niche of weapons will be desirable (the 15^50 perfect), because they will be so easily attainable (an assumption).

Mordakai · Oct 11, 2006, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two April Mornings

Definitely. This inscription addition, in the way that we are imagining it, would definitely exasterbate the problem with low req vanity skins. It actually isn't even a problem right now, it's just a side of the game that certain people are drawn toward. By adding inscriptions, I feel that almost everyone will have to be drawn to that side of the game (the trading and economic side). Making 75k for a set of 15k armor isn't all that hard--right now you can either merchant or farm for a bit, or even just quest in Cantha. By introducing inscriptions, I fear that there will be a serious drop in weapon price, because, as I and others have side, only one specific niche of weapons will be desirable (the 15^50 perfect), because they will be so easily attainable (an assumption).

OK, please clarify your statement:

Are you saying both low-req rare skins and 15^50 Inscriptions will drop in price?

I think that low req skins will rise in price, and who knows what the final price will be on 15^50 Inscriptions...

But, regardless, if you want the price on 15k armor to be lowered, start another thread. It really has nothing directly to do with the issue of Inscriptions.

derrtyboy69 · Oct 11, 2006, 08:32 PM // 20:32

All i know is I miss 700k 15>50 longswords (its already been over a year WTF)

I think most peoples fear is that the items they spend so much money is going to be available to the random scrub. The collections that they worked so hard on will be worthless. I know ill be disappointed if it happens, and miss the days of not being able to get into LA d1.

Mordakai · Oct 11, 2006, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Just curious, derrtyboy69, but why do you miss those days?

The adrenaline of the high-price sale? Because, you have the money. That's not going away. You have the items, too. Those aren't going away.

Zehnchu · Oct 11, 2006, 08:47 PM // 20:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix Ex

Yep, the current system of inscriptions will ensure that his *REQ 9* won't ever be sold ever....since req 7 and req 8 will be so easy to get then. It'll be the same for every weapon for that matter.

It is still rare to get a max damage required 7-8 of any common or rare skin weapon. So how will a required 7 and a required 8 be easier to get then a required 9? For any required 7-9 to have any type of value it must be max damage. Inscriptions have absolute nothing to do with a requirement attribute of a weapon therefore base requirement will never change.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

OK, please clarify your statement:

Are you saying both low-req rare skins and 15^50 Inscriptions will drop in price?

I think that low req skins will rise in price, and who knows what the final price will be on 15^50 Inscriptions...

But, regardless, if you want the price on 15k armor to be lowered, start another thread. It really has nothing directly to do with the issue of Inscriptions.

One would think that, if some has a clean rare skin required 7 max damage and you slap a 15^50 it’s value has doubled in price has it not? Because now you have a rare skin with a rare requirement that has a 15^50 you can apply two other mods which available and it’s tripled in price.

Inscriptions will not change the skin, requirement, damage or mods. They will not affect the drop rate of rare skins nor rare stats weapons. If you think Inscriptions are going to be easily obtainable then how so? Thinking that you can salvage them from a collector, crafter, green then you are wrong. The only way you are going to salvage a 15^50 is from a random drop, and 15^50 drops themselves are also rare.

Hyper Cutter · Oct 11, 2006, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zehnchu

Thinking that you can salvage them from a collector, crafter, green then you are wrong.

Crafter weapons can be salvaged.

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Weaponsmith

Quote:

Weapons crafted by weaponsmiths can be salvaged (unlike collector weapons).

sixdartbart · Oct 11, 2006, 09:26 PM // 21:26

I think the point several of you are missing here is that when you factor in whites/purples/golds "rare" skins weapons aren't all that rare, Low req "rare" skins are somewhat more rare and a low req "rare" skin with a good inherent damage mod is what makes the items truly rare.

Currently a low req "rare" skin with a crap damage mod will go straight to the merchant and be gone from existence.
If the new system works as people are speculating the market will be flooded with low req "rare" skins

Zehnchu; 15>50 mods are anything but rare, they are commonly found on non max/high req or other less than desirable conditions.

I think Jetdoc made a good observation that considering all of the current conditions existing it will more than likely cause anything over req 9 to become merchant food and more than likely cause anything that isn't currently considered a "rare" skin to head that way as well.

Phaern Majes · Oct 11, 2006, 10:18 PM // 22:18

/not signed

Akhilleus · Oct 11, 2006, 10:27 PM // 22:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by sumrtym

And I can tell from the attitudes of this self-appointed "trader elite" who so like to deal with other people they don't see the fun in helping others make it through a mission, or teaching someone new how to play.

Their vew is a self-centered, selfish one of this gaming world, and they can't understand anyone that doesn't share it. If you don't, you're "anti-capitalist". I think the majority of those arguing are people who enjoy being rich in a game who probably aren't in real-life (read lots of teenagers who don't work, or work minimum wage), and so are happy achieving something meaningless in a game they don't have in the real world.

i founded&led a guild of 70 people; Legio Immortalii/Heroes Of The Immortal for appx a year, where almost on a daily basis i helped people through missions, getting what they needed, teaching them how to trade or how to farm or how to pvp, or giving them pve builds.
in fact, for the first 3 months of the guilds existence i REFUSED to recruit people who were already level 20, because i believed the bond created by working and playing together was greater than that shared by people who "already have everything they need in the game." the first person who i recruited at lvl 20 still lingers around on my vent server, cool guy, called him trahern (he has posted here a few times).
it used to be my own personal policy to buy the first set of droks armor for every single guild member who hit lvl 20 for the first time. this practice ended when players kept quitting guildwars without notice (they'd go on 2-3 months activity).
in fact, i descovered that the more i handed out to people in terms of items, and the more missions we guild-ran for people (the first time around), the quicker they got bored with guildwars. which is why we eventually changed our policies.

if you dont believe me, feel free to ask any of my officers (who now play WoW), ill be happy to give you a temporary pass to my vent server (one that i paid for, i may add) if you need to substantiate that.
i have helped and assisted and cared for more new players than you will ever know, and to make yet another unfounded statement (something you in particular are VERY fond of doing) without knowing ANYTHING about the person, is ludicrous. your posts are on the border of flames.

Jetdoc · Oct 11, 2006, 10:29 PM // 22:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zehnchu

It is still rare to get a max damage required 7-8 of any common or rare skin weapon. So how will a required 7 and a required 8 be easier to get then a required 9? For any required 7-9 to have any type of value it must be max damage. Inscriptions have absolute nothing to do with a requirement attribute of a weapon therefore base requirement will never change.

One would think that, if some has a clean rare skin required 7 max damage and you slap a 15^50 it’s value has doubled in price has it not? Because now you have a rare skin with a rare requirement that has a 15^50 you can apply two other mods which available and it’s tripled in price.

Inscriptions will not change the skin, requirement, damage or mods. They will not affect the drop rate of rare skins nor rare stats weapons. If you think Inscriptions are going to be easily obtainable then how so? Thinking that you can salvage them from a collector, crafter, green then you are wrong. The only way you are going to salvage a 15^50 is from a random drop, and 15^50 drops themselves are also rare.

1. I can go outside into Perdition rock and get a requirement 7 or 8 White or Blue Fellblade in less than 15 minutes, guaranteed. Rare skin does NOT mean that it's hard to get - it just means that it's hard to get a perfect version as they only drop in certain areas.

2. Absolutely incorrect. Look at prefix and suffix modifiers...you add a +30 health pommel (which costs 40K or so) and a 20/20 sundering hilt (which costs 40K or so) to a sword that is normally worth 50K unmodded - chances are you are not going to get anywhere near 130K for it. People just simply don't pay anywhere near the full value of the "addable" modifiers when buying a weapon - you can normally expect to get 50% of their value in the modded trade.

3. There are many, many 15>50 weapons out there right now. The problem is, many of them either (1) are not max damage or (2) have very high requirements. You are thinking about the rarirty of req 7-9 15>50 weapons in your post.

I think this is some of the fallacy that people are presuming - that the market won't change significantly because these low requirement weapons and 15>50 inscriptions will be "just as rare". It simply won't - the supply of these items is just simply way too great and easy to get.

Franco · Oct 11, 2006, 10:33 PM // 22:33

Im leader of my guild aswel, sure it isnt nothing special ,just a guild I made with some friends, but anytime someone needs a loan, or a price check or a tip on something in game I ll do it, in fact i just finished helping a guildie cap a elite before i came here, so dont call anyone selfish here if you dont know what you are talking about.

ps: to sumrtym ^

Zehnchu · Oct 11, 2006, 11:59 PM // 23:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyper Cutter

Crafter weapons can be salvaged.

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Weaponsmith

You get easily sidetracked don’t you? Being able to salvage the 15^50 from a collector, crafter, and green would be open for abuse. Now show me where you can salvage the 15^50 from a crafted weapon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

Zehnchu; 15>50 mods are anything but rare, they are commonly found on non max/high req or other less than desirable conditions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

1. I can go outside into Perdition rock and get a requirement 7 or 8 White or Blue Fellblade in less than 15 minutes, guaranteed. Rare skin does NOT mean that it's hard to get - it just means that it's hard to get a perfect version as they only drop in certain areas.

Funny you should mention that since the start of this tread I’ve been carefully looking for the 15^50 before I mech all my drops. Before you get the wrong assumptions items that I have merch have been quite numerous and I have yet to get anything that is 15^50. Further more I have yet to get a drop that is max damage with a requirement 7 of any color. A white requirement 8 max damage is what I have found so far.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

2. Absolutely incorrect. Look at prefix and suffix modifiers...you add a +30 health pommel (which costs 40K or so) and a 20/20 sundering hilt (which costs 40K or so) to a sword that is normally worth 50K unmodded - chances are you are not going to get anywhere near 130K for it. People just simply don't pay anywhere near the full value of the "addable" modifiers when buying a weapon - you can normally expect to get 50% of their value in the modded trade.

If that was the case then this thread wouldn’t be 60+ pages have of doom and gloom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

3. There are many, many 15>50 weapons out there right now. The problem is, many of them either (1) are not max damage or (2) have very high requirements. You are thinking about the rarirty of req 7-9 15>50 weapons in your post.

I think this is some of the fallacy that people are presuming - that the market won't change significantly because these low requirement weapons and 15>50 inscriptions will be "just as rare". It simply won't - the supply of these items is just simply way too great and easy to get.

True and a lot for them come from crafters, collectors, and of course greens. You assume that I care about the requirements and skin which I don’t. I am quite happy with my required 9 15^50 dado sword it deals the same damage as any required 9 15^50 weapon.

As I said in a pervious post you will see some high end values drop and some of the lower end values rise. This is one thing that is not uncommon to GW, it’s the cycle of things.

Rok · Oct 12, 2006, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

1. I can go outside into Perdition rock and get a requirement 7 or 8 White or Blue Fellblade in less than 15 minutes, guaranteed. Rare skin does NOT mean that it's hard to get - it just means that it's hard to get a perfect version as they only drop in certain areas.

2. Absolutely incorrect. Look at prefix and suffix modifiers...you add a +30 health pommel (which costs 40K or so) and a 20/20 sundering hilt (which costs 40K or so) to a sword that is normally worth 50K unmodded - chances are you are not going to get anywhere near 130K for it. People just simply don't pay anywhere near the full value of the "addable" modifiers when buying a weapon - you can normally expect to get 50% of their value in the modded trade.

3. There are many, many 15>50 weapons out there right now. The problem is, many of them either (1) are not max damage or (2) have very high requirements. You are thinking about the rarirty of req 7-9 15>50 weapons in your post.

I think this is some of the fallacy that people are presuming - that the market won't change significantly because these low requirement weapons and 15>50 inscriptions will be "just as rare". It simply won't - the supply of these items is just simply way too great and easy to get.

You are right. So now I can take one of my many perfect inherent mods and put it on one of those and have a decent fellblade without paying an outrageous price ... Something I would never do anyway.

I never trade, so that doesn't affect me either. Casual players cannot afford to pay ridiculous prices for a max mod. High req weapons should be merch'd anyway, anything over 9 is worthless because greens, etc are available. But now we can salvage any good mods off before doing so.

There is no fallacy ... We know this will affect the market. We don't care. Like I said, I don't trade, so this will benefit me greatly. I can put my own weapons together now. I used to merch any non perfect weapon, now I save them if max dmg/low req/max mod so I can salvage and piece together myself. The casual gamer ftw.

cellardweller · Oct 12, 2006, 01:30 AM // 01:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix Ex

98% of the times when I actually tries to help a people, I get flamed just because I can't save a tanking ele trying to tank a lvl 28 boss, and the fact that I don't run at a speed of light to save a wammo a radar away, or a MM using botm every time its recharged expecting me to heal him everytime. I am flamed for not bringing flesh golem and instead was using aura of the lich to spam heal my "lesser minions". I got flamed for having firestorm on my skill bar even though I was using it as a scarecrow exclusively.

Getting competent friends with social skills FTW?

Phoenix Ex · Oct 12, 2006, 01:40 AM // 01:40

I was talking about PUGS, in response to whoever it was saying I am a selfish elite trader that don't go help people. And those are the reasons. As for my friends....freakin 7 max title does NOT need my help lol

.

cellardweller · Oct 12, 2006, 02:35 AM // 02:35

I know this is getting kind of off topic, but I do find it incredibly hard to believe that you can find nothing to do in guildwars.... Are you trying to say you never have "I'm going to edge crawl abbadons, wanna come?" invites from people? You can't possibly tell me every one of your friends has 8 toons with dual explorer/dual protector titles?

Malice Black · Oct 12, 2006, 03:01 AM // 03:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

i founded&led a guild of 70 people; Legio Immortalii/Heroes Of The Immortal for appx a year, where almost on a daily basis i helped people through missions, getting what they needed, teaching them how to trade or how to farm or how to pvp, or giving them pve builds.
in fact, for the first 3 months of the guilds existence i REFUSED to recruit people who were already level 20, because i believed the bond created by working and playing together was greater than that shared by people who "already have everything they need in the game." the first person who i recruited at lvl 20 still lingers around on my vent server, cool guy, called him trahern (he has posted here a few times).
it used to be my own personal policy to buy the first set of droks armor for every single guild member who hit lvl 20 for the first time. this practice ended when players kept quitting guildwars without notice (they'd go on 2-3 months activity).
in fact, i descovered that the more i handed out to people in terms of items, and the more missions we guild-ran for people (the first time around), the quicker they got bored with guildwars. which is why we eventually changed our policies.

if you dont believe me, feel free to ask any of my officers (who now play WoW), ill be happy to give you a temporary pass to my vent server (one that i paid for, i may add) if you need to substantiate that.
i have helped and assisted and cared for more new players than you will ever know, and to make yet another unfounded statement (something you in particular are VERY fond of doing) without knowing ANYTHING about the person, is ludicrous. your posts are on the border of flames.

I was in Akh guild for a while, he ran a well organized group of misfits.

Tommy · Oct 12, 2006, 03:11 AM // 03:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

i founded&led a guild of 70 people; Legio Immortalii/Heroes Of The Immortal for appx a year, where almost on a daily basis i helped people through missions, getting what they needed, teaching them how to trade or how to farm or how to pvp, or giving them pve builds.
in fact, for the first 3 months of the guilds existence i REFUSED to recruit people who were already level 20, because i believed the bond created by working and playing together was greater than that shared by people who "already have everything they need in the game." the first person who i recruited at lvl 20 still lingers around on my vent server, cool guy, called him trahern (he has posted here a few times).
it used to be my own personal policy to buy the first set of droks armor for every single guild member who hit lvl 20 for the first time. this practice ended when players kept quitting guildwars without notice (they'd go on 2-3 months activity).
in fact, i descovered that the more i handed out to people in terms of items, and the more missions we guild-ran for people (the first time around), the quicker they got bored with guildwars. which is why we eventually changed our policies.

if you dont believe me, feel free to ask any of my officers (who now play WoW), ill be happy to give you a temporary pass to my vent server (one that i paid for, i may add) if you need to substantiate that.
i have helped and assisted and cared for more new players than you will ever know, and to make yet another unfounded statement (something you in particular are VERY fond of doing) without knowing ANYTHING about the person, is ludicrous. your posts are on the border of flames.

ah

( why didn't you help me out in mission and trade akh T_T

Mordakai · Oct 12, 2006, 04:06 AM // 04:06

Argument against Inscription 1:

"I won't have anything left to do."

That sounds like a personal problem, not a problem with Inscriptions. Inscriptions will not change the drop rates of rare perfect weapons, nothing is stopping you from trying to find them instead of using the Inscription method.

Argument against Inscription 2:

"Prices will fall, and there will be no way to get 15k armor."

Well, first I think that should be the topic of another thread, that in your opinion, 15k armor price is too high.

But, just to refute that, my brand new necro has made over 30k in only 30 hours of just playing the game! No farming, no trades, nada. Just merchant sales, missions, quests, and being cheap, cheap, cheap.

Argument against Inscription 3:

"All my high-end stuff will become worthless and common."

No. You will still own your perfect rare weapons. No one can take that away from you. Yes, maybe it will lose some value, but that is the nature of an online game. But it will only be "worthless" if you never valued the item in the first place, and only associated value with a changeable market-driven price. A risky proposition, to be sure.

Any others I missed?

manitoba1073 · Oct 12, 2006, 04:13 AM // 04:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

here is a little bit of Jeff Strain on this.
Quote:
JS: You'll often hear us say that Guild Wars is a game without the grind. However, if you want to spend 100 hours trying to get a specific upgrade for an item, like a dragon-tooth hilt and a wyvern skill scabbard for your sword, that's fine. You have a specific goal in mind, and you want that item. What's not fine is “at level 20 I can access this dungeon, and at level 30 I can access that dungeon and there's a 1000 hours between them”. Obviously, the goals are shorter than that, or you just wouldn't do it… but we very much DIFERRENTIATE TYPES OF TIME SINKS. And that differentiation is if it's for fun, or whether it's to arbitrarily take and stretch the 70 hours of content you have for game and stretch it over a thousand hours. Is it for fun or is it to try and get people addicted, so that you can collect another month of subscription fees?
You have to be able to make a judgement call. You look at the activities players are doing, and divide them into “People do that because it's fun” and “People do that because they have to”. Let's keep the stuff that's fun.
FUN ....NOT HAVE TO GRIND FROM JEFF STRAIN HIMSELF

apperrantely you yourself didnt actually read it. because no where does it say not have to grind. he says there are different types of time sinks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

Who are you talking to?

Funny, when I read the Guild Wars box, I didn't read a sell point saying: "Enjoy grinding for high value loot only available to hardcore players!"

You were never promised million gold weapons to strive for. It, IMO, goes against the whole GW philosophy of "less grind".

In any case, there still will be high priced items. You will still have some insane goal to reach towards.

and no where on the box says you will not have to do things to get what you want.

no there is no so called philosophy of less grind in guildwars. there is the philosophy that the goals to achieve what you want does not necessarily have to take 1000's of hours. doesnt mean that u can have it right away either.

please reread what jeff strain said, and lovitar clearly pointed out about but was wrong. yes you was lovitar sorry you where wrong, but you are. just look at what he says on the first part and then the last part

You'll often hear us say that Guild Wars is a game without the grind.

You have to be able to make a judgement call. You look at the activities players are doing, and divide them into “People do that because it's fun” and “People do that because they have to”. Let's keep the stuff that's fun.

now we alrdy know that ppl have different ideas of fun. that there are different types of time sinks.